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Build-up Threads Long term build up threads only please. This forum will be very heavily moderated. If you have a question about content, pm Logjam before posting it.

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Old 01-12-2005, 06:07 PM   #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FireMedic
Ugg. I don't have it in me. I'd rather weld it then cut it off later if I had to. Maybe we should get together and have a decent size batch of them made??? So they might be a little cheaper.
Come and help me make my transfer case crossmember. I made some of those 3 bolt flanges a while back. I don't have any more, but they do grow on trees.
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Old 01-12-2005, 07:09 PM   #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chumly2071
Brook-
Looking at the pics in post #129, what method/procedure do you use to layout and/or cut the copes on your tubing? This is an area I am needing to work on when I put on my "master fabricator" ;-) persona in the garage. They all look like they are very tightly fit. I'm jealous of your skills!!
all the coping on the spring mounts was done by hand with a 4.5" grinder and a norton flapper wheel. All the complex coping on the cage was done with a 4.5" grinder and a regular norton grinding wheel that was designed to be used flat or on end. The simple notches were done with a pro-tools hole saw notcher (4 on the cage I think)

Tubing notchers are nice, but they in no way replace doing it by hand.
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Old 01-13-2005, 02:04 AM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Logjam
Come and help me make my transfer case crossmember. I made some of those 3 bolt flanges a while back. I don't have any more, but they do grow on trees.
Ahh yes...I have seen that tree....it looks a little like a CNC Plasma Table When are you gonna do the T-case crossmember??
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Old 01-13-2005, 04:36 AM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgreen
all the coping on the spring mounts was done by hand with a 4.5" grinder and a norton flapper wheel. All the complex coping on the cage was done with a 4.5" grinder and a regular norton grinding wheel that was designed to be used flat or on end. The simple notches were done with a pro-tools hole saw notcher (4 on the cage I think)

Tubing notchers are nice, but they in no way replace doing it by hand.
gotcha, but how (say in the instance of the bent tubes intersecting the threaded part for your spring height adjuster) do you mark the tube for the coping operation? I am having trouble picturing how to place the tube "close" and get accurate copes marked out. Or, do you just mark -cut - try it - repeat until it fits perfect? Remember, I am an engineer, so it is a given that I would overlook the simple solutions...
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Old 01-13-2005, 06:17 PM   #155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chumly2071
gotcha, but how (say in the instance of the bent tubes intersecting the threaded part for your spring height adjuster) do you mark the tube for the coping operation? I am having trouble picturing how to place the tube "close" and get accurate copes marked out. Or, do you just mark -cut - try it - repeat until it fits perfect? Remember, I am an engineer, so it is a given that I would overlook the simple solutions...
I just eyeball it, grind a little, test fit, eyeball it, grind more, test fit, eyeball it, grind more, and on and on and on. After a while a guy gets pretty good at it. Especially if he always works toward an absolute perfect fit every time.
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Old 01-14-2005, 07:30 AM   #156
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Brook,

Man you had to make some sweet adjustable brackets, you didn't like the bracket you made on progect cheap? . Very sweet looking, no more swiss cheese brackets but I'm not seeing something. The sleeve is slotted and the portion that slides inbetween the bushing bracket is attached only at the bottom? Does the nut contact the barrel? Or is the load transmitted to the the barrel by the bushing bracket? I'm assuming that the threaded rod isn't taking the load, right? Which end will be up when it's mounted? Got it mounted yet?

I like that you'll be able to adjust it to see what difference it makes and then run it were you like it. Probably want to get it dialed in before mud squeeses in through the slots an hardens up solid. I also thought stations axle brackets looked pretty slick, then you'd be adjustable at both ends.

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Old 01-15-2005, 11:32 PM   #157
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I mocked up the suspension today, using the same angles the the old suspension had, but placing the links where I thought they should be as far as the chassis ends are concerned. With said geometry, I end up with 124% antisquat, and a 5* roll axis. The roll center height is 25.16". All based on a 48" COG.

The project for tomorrow is to hack the lower link mounts off the axle, and build new ones to double triangulate the rear suspension. With bushings, and how little actual triangulation I have been running, I could possibly have more side to side movement that I want. Its hard to to say really, because I have nothing to compare to. Especially with 45" tractor tires on home narrowed rims and bead locked rims. Triangulating the lowers should improve the stability greatly, with little to no negatives.

A few pics to show the crossmember that supports the front of the gas tank, and stuff

Pic one shows the suspension as it would give me 124% antisquat, with a theoretical COG height of 48"

Pic two just gives an overall view of the progress so far.

Pic three shows nothing (just that there is no turning back now )
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Old 01-16-2005, 08:47 PM   #158
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I spent most of the day cleaning off what was left of the old brackets on the 14 bolt, then cleaning up the mess I made in the shop. **** that was alot of grinding!

I will say this. Buy GOOD grinding wheels, I prefer Norton products. I started cleaning up the 14 bolt with a Dewalt wheel that I bought from Home Depot, it lasted all of 5 minutes. Then I went with a high quality "fast cut" wheel made by Norton. This wheel was half worn out already, and it lasted through the next 2 hrs of heavy grinding. (grinding that was nearly stalling out my 4.5" hand grinder) They cost about 2 bucks more per wheel, but you will remove literally 10 times the material with them.

I finally welded the "weld washers" on my link brackets. (Brackets are 1/4" A36 plate, and the washers are 5/16" thick 4140. I assembled the washers and bracket with a bolt that was long enough that the shoulder passed clear through the washers so I was sure they would be centered. Torqued the nut just enough that it would hold the assy steady while I tacked it in place. Then pre-heated the entire assy to about 400 degrees so that the weldment wouldnt draw heat away from the weld too fast causing cracking. In further effort to eliminate cracking, I used 309L SS filler rod.

This is the welder I used. its a Lincoln 300 running on 220v. Old school, but runs sweet. I even broke out the old clunky hand amptrol to make sure I had enough control on my starts and stops.

These are what Im going to be using for my rear bumpstops. They are called Timbrens, and are supposed to be used as overload springs. I think they are going to be sweet! I'll post some tech on these later if I remember.
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Old 01-16-2005, 08:56 PM   #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgreen
Buy GOOD grinding wheels, I prefer Norton products. I started cleaning up the 14 bolt with a Dewalt wheel that I bought from Home Depot, it lasted all of 5 minutes. Then I went with a high quality "fast cut" wheel made by Norton. This wheel was half worn out already, and it lasted through the next 2 hrs of heavy grinding. (grinding that was nearly stalling out my 4.5" hand grinder) They cost about 2 bucks more per wheel, but you will remove literally 10 times the material with them.
While I don't think the rest of this thread will do more than make me jealous, I like the tip on the wheels. This should also make less mess for the amount of grinding since there should be 1/10 of the usual wheel debris on the floor, in my hair, clothes, nose, etc. Where do you get the Norton stuff?
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Old 01-16-2005, 09:34 PM   #160
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I get them from Air Gas. See if they will give you a student discount, or let you use the discount from one of their larger clients. If they do, you will end up getting really good wheels for about the same price as the ****ty ones.

I built the whole back end of the freak notching tubing with dewalt grinding wheels. I must have went through 10 of them, maybe more. I could have done it with one Norton!

When you buy the wheels, look on the lable for a little symbol of a grinder and an angle. I always buy the ones that are designated for 0*to 90* cutting. Also, I suggest getting the "fast cut" wheels to do all the hogging, and use 80 grit norton flapper wheels for finish work, and light grinding. They are spendy, but they finish very well, AND hog alot of metal.
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Old 01-16-2005, 09:41 PM   #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlaskaToy
While I don't think the rest of this thread will do more than make me jealous, I like the tip on the wheels.
I hope you get more out of this thread than that. If not, this is all a waste of time. When I started working on this truck, I had taken a few hours of SMAW welding class, and machined some stuff in school. I didnt know anything about fabricating, much less chassis design/engineering. It was threads similar to this one, on various discussion boards, and peoples personal web pages, that got me inspired to try new things for myself. Its been a huge learning curve. I started out by keeping things as simple as possible, such as using the stock spring mounts to hold the frame end of my lower links. As time went on, I read more books, asked more questions, and built more stuff for myself. a few years later, here is where I am.
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Old 01-16-2005, 09:53 PM   #162
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It was a thinly veiled attempt at a compliment. You are by no means wasting your time or mine! Thanks for taking the time to document your work. Very cool. Please press on. And thanks again for the tips on the wheels. I've been in AirGas several time here in Fbx, but they seem to always have been out of stock on 4.5" stuff when I'm there.

BTW can you link a good place to get a good understanding of the fundamentals and terms of link suspensions? Things like roll center antisquat, etc. I have a basic understanding of the principles but no idea how to go about calculating what lengths and angles are best for a vehicle/purpose.
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Old 01-17-2005, 12:24 AM   #163
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all i can say brook, is I am impressed. I have learned alot of stuff i would normally not even think about, and learned alot bout welding tips and the tubing that shoudl be used for this kinda stuff..... hope you keep us updated with progress! awesome
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Old 01-17-2005, 09:12 AM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgreen
I will say this. Buy GOOD grinding wheels, I prefer Norton products. I started cleaning up the 14 bolt with a Dewalt wheel that I bought from Home Depot, it lasted all of 5 minutes. Then I went with a high quality "fast cut" wheel made by Norton. This wheel was half worn out already, and it lasted through the next 2 hrs of heavy grinding. (grinding that was nearly stalling out my 4.5" hand grinder) They cost about 2 bucks more per wheel, but you will remove literally 10 times the material with them.

I agree. When I was cleaning all the leaf spring stuff off my axle, and the wrap bar mounts. I bought a 11 dollar grinding wheel. Pretty sure it was a Norton. Course my Dad thought it was a joke But that sucker cleaned that whole axle down. And went on to gring link mount tabs... Thats the only wheels I will buy now. They are spendy. But worth it... Those ol' $3 dollar wheels just fly apart. Shooting pieces of the thing as they go..
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Old 01-17-2005, 09:21 AM   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlaskaToy
It was a thinly veiled attempt at a compliment. You are by no means wasting your time or mine! Thanks for taking the time to document your work. Very cool. Please press on. And thanks again for the tips on the wheels. I've been in AirGas several time here in Fbx, but they seem to always have been out of stock on 4.5" stuff when I'm there.

BTW can you link a good place to get a good understanding of the fundamentals and terms of link suspensions? Things like roll center antisquat, etc. I have a basic understanding of the principles but no idea how to go about calculating what lengths and angles are best for a vehicle/purpose.

I know you asked Brook. But I have found a couple of places to do so... He might have more. I also have a couple of more.. Will have to go threw favorites

http://home.att.net/~email.id/wsb/ht...ome.html-.html

Then of course the link calculator thread....

Link Calculator
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Old 01-17-2005, 06:53 PM   #166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlaskaToy
BTW can you link a good place to get a good understanding of the fundamentals and terms of link suspensions? Things like roll center antisquat, etc. I have a basic understanding of the principles but no idea how to go about calculating what lengths and angles are best for a vehicle/purpose.
IMO, your best off to buy a few books. But if you dont want to do that, post a new thread, and see what kind of input you get. I know there are a few people on here that have a good understanding of suspension design.
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Old 01-17-2005, 11:43 PM   #167
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You should find plenty with some web searching. A lot of stuff is the same for race car types, they just have less travle and different needs...
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Old 01-18-2005, 01:34 PM   #168
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Should have never used goggles when a welding hood was needed.
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Old 01-18-2005, 04:13 PM   #169
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norton makes good stuff we get it at grainger being hte muni/asd... Brook , what is that hand amp troll thing? I have a Lincoln Square Wave Tig at the shop I have been playing with more nad more , but seem to toast right through thin guage stainless
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Old 01-18-2005, 07:00 PM   #170
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the hand amptrol works just like a foot amptrol would, it allows you to vary the current within a certain range. 0 amps to XXX amps. One cool benefit is that it triggers a solenoid to turn on and off your gas flow.
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Old 01-18-2005, 10:42 PM   #171
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Yeah TIG is way nice. My brother was telling me that he welded a bunch of soda cans together with TIG one day just for some practice.
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Old 01-23-2005, 04:50 PM   #172
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So how is the progress going watching this close for ideas the Blazer it is going to be going under the knife soon. The body is falling off so time for a change
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Old 01-23-2005, 06:02 PM   #173
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I dont have much to show for this weekends work. I spent all day friday driving up to wasilla and visiting with the guys at Alaska Roteq, and part of the day on Saturday talking to a guy about a slope job. But I did finally finish the adjustable link mounts.

To make sure the brackets dont rattle or have slop, I drilled out three holes in the back of the can, and welded some 3/8 nuts on. This will allow me to load the inner nut with a regular hex head cap screw. Also, the holes allow access to the nut for greasing. (I just drilled a small hole in the nut, and chamfered it... More on this later) I also drilled some small holes in each end cap.

Also shown in the pics below are the lower link, frame end, brackets.
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Old 01-23-2005, 07:55 PM   #174
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all that bling, and then rusty flex-pipe for exhaust :devil4:
I know it's a ways off but do you have a new plan for it? Or the same flex-pipe and Supertrapps?
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Old 01-23-2005, 08:24 PM   #175
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The flex pipe was a quick fix to quiet the truck down for moose season. There will be something nicer before it hits the trail again!
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